India vaccine export blockade

[onthemove]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-56513371

"India has placed a temporary hold on all exports of the Oxford-AstraZeneca coronavirus vaccine ... "...Domestic demand will have to take precedence," one foreign ministry source told the BBC's Soutik Biswas.

Let's see if the response to this matches the response to the (so-called) 'EU blockade'.

The EU haven't blocked any vaccines to the UK yet.
India has already blocked 5 million doses that were due for delivery to the UK.

Boo-hiss, nasty .... ermm, EU?

[servodude]

...the BBC's Soutik Biswas....
India has already blocked 5 million doses that were due for delivery to the UK.
Boo-hiss, nasty .... ermm, EU?

One expects better standards of first-world govt organisations.

I wonder if it's BBC policy to employ anagrams.

V8

I remember Anna Ford... Ana Grams not so much

India blockading exports of vaccine is "quite a big thing" given how much of that kind of stuff they make
- when I read the original post I thought the BBC had pulled a "North-east man lost at sea"
- but it does seem that they've covered it as a blanket ban on exports

So much for global collaboration!
What if Yong-Zhen Zhang and Edward Holmes had kept quiet after sequencing the genome? (Which was China's original plan!)
Time for a beer

-sd

[Nimrod103]

...the BBC's Soutik Biswas....
India has already blocked 5 million doses that were due for delivery to the UK.
Boo-hiss, nasty .... ermm, EU?

One expects better standards of first-world govt organisations.

I wonder if it's BBC policy to employ anagrams.

V8

As reported it depends very much on the terms of the contracts. It has been reported in the media that the UK contract with SI in Pune does not have strict timings or priorities attached, whereas the UK contracts with AZ in the UK and Pfizer in Belgium do.

[Arborbridge]

...the BBC's Soutik Biswas....
India has already blocked 5 million doses that were due for delivery to the UK.
Boo-hiss, nasty .... ermm, EU?

One expects better standards of first-world govt organisations.

I wonder if it's BBC policy to employ anagrams.

V8

In my view, both the EU and India are taking rational steps when one considers their first duty is to their own populations. It's always seems a bit odd that India, with a huge population to vaccinate, is allowing companies to export vaccine doses. It doesn't make sense from their POV or that of the EU to not have to benefit of products which they are making themselves.

I don't get the reference to anagrams at the BBC unless you are laughing at a foreign name, which is really a bit 70s, is it not? I think we have some very strange names in this country - notably amongst the aristocracy.

Arb.

[Nimrod103]

In my view, both the EU and India are taking rational steps when one considers their first duty is to their own populations. It's always seems a bit odd that India, with a huge population to vaccinate, is allowing companies to export vaccine doses. It doesn't make sense from their POV or that of the EU to not have to benefit of products which they are making themselves.

So might is right? A vital ingredient in the Pfizer Belgium plant is manufactured in Yorkshire. So the UK should withold export of that component if our contracted supplies are stopped?
AIUI SI in Pune were only given the licence to manufacture OxAZ because they are so big that only they can supply the significant amounts required by the Covax scheme for poor countries. Perhaps India should stop Covax exports as well?

[GeoffF100]

So might is right?

Arb did not say that.

A vital ingredient in the Pfizer Belgium plant is manufactured in Yorkshire. So the UK should withold export of that component if our contracted supplies are stopped?

Of course not. Blocking the supply of a vaccine component to sabotage vaccine production would be highly immoral and wrong.

AIUI SI in Pune were only given the licence to manufacture OxAZ because they are so big that only they can supply the significant amounts required by the Covax scheme for poor countries.

Is that a fact? I believe that supplying India matters too.

Perhaps India should stop Covax exports as well?

It has.

[Nimrod103]

So might is right?

Arb did not say that.

He did say that. In different words. He implied that India (and the EU) were right to ignore contractual obligations, on the grounds that since the vaccines were sitting in vials in their own countries, their duty was to prevent their export.

[GeoffF100]

Arb did not say that.

He did say that. In different words. He implied that India (and the EU) were right to ignore contractual obligations, on the grounds that since the vaccines were sitting in vials in their own countries, their duty was to prevent their export.

Perhaps you are right. On reflection, I have a different view. I will start another thread in the morality issues.

[Nimrod103]

AIUI SI in Pune were only given the licence to manufacture OxAZ because they are so big that only they can supply the significant amounts required by the Covax scheme for poor countries.

Is that a fact? I believe that supplying India matters too.

It is my understanding that SI in Pune are by far the largest vaccine producer in the World, and production there is destined to be a major component of the Covax project, in addition to supplying the Indian market.
Of course, next time there is a pandemic, the players behaviour is likely to be very diffierent. AZ will never do a project on a non profit basis again (https://order-order.com/2021/03/25/list ... er-eu-row/). Very likely no company will go that route. Profiteering is the only thing that makes sense. The UK Govt (major backers of AZ) has really been hung out to dry on this act of generosity. I hope next time they learn to gouge the market for all they can get.

[vagrantbrain]

In my view, both the EU and India are taking rational steps when one considers their first duty is to their own populations. It's always seems a bit odd that India, with a huge population to vaccinate, is allowing companies to export vaccine doses. It doesn't make sense from their POV or that of the EU to not have to benefit of products which they are making themselves.

Whether it makes sense or not is not relevant - what matters is what is in the contracts between the companies making the vaccines and their customers. I find it concerning the ease with which politicians and a sizeable amount of the population think contracts are optional and need only be followed when it's convenient for them. If the EU were so desperate for supply then frankly they should have negotiated a better deal than best endeavours and insisting on a new supply chain being set up for them.

As an aside, it annoys me when I see people talk about the UK, or the EU, or India making vaccines - they're not. Private enterprises are. They may be based in these areas and have plants in these areas but they're not state-run companies.

[Arborbridge]

In my view, both the EU and India are taking rational steps when one considers their first duty is to their own populations. It's always seems a bit odd that India, with a huge population to vaccinate, is allowing companies to export vaccine doses. It doesn't make sense from their POV or that of the EU to not have to benefit of products which they are making themselves.

Whether it makes sense or not is not relevant - what matters is what is in the contracts between the companies making the vaccines and their customers. I find it concerning the ease with which politicians and a sizeable amount of the population think contracts are optional and need only be followed when it's convenient for them. If the EU were so desperate for supply then frankly they should have negotiated a better deal than best endeavours and insisting on a new supply chain being set up for them.

As an aside, it annoys me when I see people talk about the UK, or the EU, or India making vaccines - they're not. Private enterprises are. They may be based in these areas and have plants in these areas but they're not state-run companies.

Whether it makes sense or not is not relevant - what matters is what is in the contracts between the companies making the vaccines and their customers.

Actually, a number of informed and moderate people trying to solve this crisi have pointed out that the contracts are actually not important factor. When in the think of the fight to subdue the pandemic, contracts are not at all important except in the purely legalistic and, one might say, dog in the manger world of some politicians.

What is important at this point is how to obtain the greatest benefit to the greatest number of people - most particularly in our local region with which we trade. That means the UK and Europe are bound together to find solutions to even out distribution - and I'm glad to see the politicians appear to have realised that. The contracts are irrelevant unless one is going to sue one of the companies, and that isn't solving any problem but making matters worse. Confrontation and not collaboration would result.

Quite frankly, at this distance from when the contracts were signed, it's all splitting hairs whether we ordered first or they did. Getting more vaccine produced and into people's arms is the answer, then the silly political sniping amd accusing this or that organisation of being a "bully"* can stop.

*when they are nothing of the sort, unless one lives in a newspaper editor's fantasy world of twist hatred.
Arb.

[Arborbridge]

Arb did not say that.

He did say that. In different words. He implied that India (and the EU) were right to ignore contractual obligations, on the grounds that since the vaccines were sitting in vials in their own countries, their duty was to prevent their export.

Yes, I believe we have gone beyond waving contracts - they are not relevant or helpful when in the middle of a crisis. Interestingly, this view has also been proposed by several of the more sensible minds I've heard commenting, mainly from the scientific establishment. It's really enlightening to hear such people talk about ways of solving problems rather than the fevered tones of editors of nationalistic newspapers.

At least there were signs yesterday that poloticians are trying to turn down the heat and put their heads together.

[Nimrod103]

What is important at this point is how to obtain the greatest benefit to the greatest number of people

Surely what is most important, is to share out the overall suffering from the pandemic as equally as possible. As many here have pointed out, the UK has suffered a disproportionately high number of deaths, possibly even the highest.

Hence the UK should have most access to the life saving vaccines.