The Lemon Fool

Over the years, I've collected an old Halifax Sharebuilder account and two ISA accounts.

With the changes in the dividend allowances, I'd like to start transferring, from April asap, all the high divi payers into my ISAs.

I'd like to start using the Halifax account for those mainly Growth ETFs and ITs that don't pay dividends, or at least very small divis.

I already have some of these in my ISAs, such as SMT, BNKR, MNKS etc, and there's not much I can do about that.

Any suggestions? Preferably USA/Canada/EM/global funds growth, acc. funds.

BRK, S&P500 acc.tracker ETFs etc?

Steve

PS The Halifax account is nowhere as big as the ISAs, and CGT will not be a problem.

It all depends upon your attitude and wants.

I'm starting to think that SMT looks far too cheap at the moment, and considering if I should top up. The issue is that I'd really need to consider selling income producing assets, just as I give up work.

Mr Anderson has retired, but Mr Selby seems to have similar interests.

You might also consider researching PHI. They may match your EM idea's.

stevensfo wrote:Any suggestions? Preferably USA/Canada/EM/global funds growth, acc. funds.

BRK, S&P500 acc.tracker ETFs etc?

Note that accumulation ("acc") units/funds don't help, per se, with the dividend tax situation. You must still declare and potentially get taxed on the dividends that the acc fund automatically rolls up. Further, each rolled up dividend increases the base cost for capital gains tax purposes, so you have to keep track of that, until you sell

IOW, the taxman considers acc funds just as if you'd received the dividends in hand, and decided to reinvest them in the fund yourself, and taxes you accordingly. Many folks consider them a record keeping p.i.t.a. outside of an ISA/SIPP.

mc2fool wrote:

stevensfo wrote:Any suggestions? Preferably USA/Canada/EM/global funds growth, acc. funds.

BRK, S&P500 acc.tracker ETFs etc?

Note that accumulation ("acc") units/funds don't help, per se, with the dividend tax situation. You must still declare and potentially get taxed on the dividends that the acc fund automatically rolls up. Further, each rolled up dividend increases the base cost for capital gains tax purposes, so you have to keep track of that, until you sell

IOW, the taxman considers acc funds just as if you'd received the dividends in hand, and decided to reinvest them in the fund yourself, and taxes you accordingly. Many folks consider them a record keeping p.i.t.a. outside of an ISA/SIPP.

Thanks, I'd forgotten about how acc. funds are treated. Up to now, I've never had to worry, since divis from my non-ISA holdings have always been just around the 2000 mark. Of course, that's going to change.

However, I believe that there are funds that don't pay any divis, accumulated or distributing. e.f. Berkshire Hathaway (BRK.B), Baillie Gifford USA Growth (USA) etc. So I'd only have CGT to worry about sometime in the future - though since I will slowly but surely shunt everything into ISAs, it's unlikely to be a problem.

I'm sure there must be many more growth funds that pay either zero or very low divis. Yes, SMT etc.

Steve

Depending on what you're looking to invest in, you could consider checking out some of the USA/Canada/EM/global funds growth, acc. funds ETFs. BRK, S&P500 acc.tracker ETFs could be a good fit. If you're looking for something specific, you can always do some research online to find the best-fit funds and ETFs that meet your needs.

Some growthy ITs that pay no dividends, i.e. have a zero percent yield:

Herald
Smithson
North Atlantic Small Companies
BG US Growth
Edinburgh worldwide
Allianz Tech
BG Shin Nippon
JPM India
Biotech Growth

You can find more by going to Trustnet and sorting the set of all ITs by dividend yield.

As well as Trustnet, there's also a screener available on AIC, which may be more filter-friendly, although I suspect there may be a slight difference in which funds come up.

https://www.theaic.co.uk/investment-com ... $$ALL_5549

There is a manager who has two ITs, one dividend paying and the other not, specifically for this reason. Perhaps someone will remind me of the names.

torata

stevensfo wrote: I'd like to start using the Halifax account for those mainly Growth ETFs and ITs that don't pay dividends, or at least very small divis.

I already have some of these in my ISAs, such as SMT, BNKR, MNKS etc, and there's not much I can do about that.

Erm, can you not sell those and rebuy in the unsheltered account, and swap the high divi ones into the ISAs? OK, there's spread and costs, but it might be better than paying tax.

Otherwise BRKB has no divi, nor does Direct Line at the moment, and HSBC FTSE All World Income global tracker pays just over 1%.

Paul

torata wrote: There is a manager who has two ITs, one dividend paying and the other not, specifically for this reason. Perhaps someone will remind me of the names.
torata

You may be thinking of Columbia Threadneedle ("CT") Global Managed Portfolio Trust plc. Manager is Peter Hewitt.

It's a very neat concept and there's a good podcast interview with him about the trust on the "Money Makers" podcast from December 22 which I really enjoyed. I was minded to invest in some of the capital share class as a way of using up CGT allowances without a lot of effort. Unfortunately, though, when I looked at the recent performance of the fund it was less than underwhelming so I didn't invest in the end.

DrFfybes wrote:

stevensfo wrote: I'd like to start using the Halifax account for those mainly Growth ETFs and ITs that don't pay dividends, or at least very small divis.

I already have some of these in my ISAs, such as SMT, BNKR, MNKS etc, and there's not much I can do about that.

Erm, can you not sell those and rebuy in the unsheltered account, and swap the high divi ones into the ISAs? OK, there's spread and costs, but it might be better than paying tax.

Otherwise BRKB has no divi, nor does Direct Line at the moment, and HSBC FTSE All World Income global tracker pays just over 1%.

Paul

You are completely right! Thanks a lot!

I realise now that this never occurred to me simply because at the moment, I''m accumulating in my 2nd ISA and most of the low/zero div holdings are in an older ssISA that cannot currently receive new funding. But of course, provided I don't add new funds to it, I am still allowed to buy/sell.

Funnily enough, Halifax just asked me if I want to open an ISA with them! It would make life easier, but I'm not sure I want or need three ISAs.

Steve

stevensfo wrote:

DrFfybes wrote: Erm, can you not sell those and rebuy in the unsheltered account, and swap the high divi ones into the ISAs? .

Paul

You are completely right! Thanks a lot!

I realise now that this never occurred to me simply because at the moment, I''m accumulating in my 2nd ISA and most of the low/zero div holdings are in an older ssISA that cannot currently receive new funding. But of course, provided I don't add new funds to it, I am still allowed to buy/sell.

Steve

No problem - it is odd how sometimes you get focussed down a route and are blind to the completely obvious, like us looking at topping up income with Divis and taking them from ISAs and unsheltered assets. Until someone pointed out we should be selling unsheltered assets to the value of the ISA divis and reinvesting the ISA divis inside the tax wrapper, rather than withdrawing £xx from the ISAs whilst still transferring in £40k each year.

I have ATT in a non ISA account does that mean I do not have to declare a dividend for this as the fund declare it gives no dividend

Meg201 wrote:I have ATT in a non ISA account does that mean I do not have to declare a dividend for this as the fund declare it gives no dividend

That's Allianz Technology IT presumably
https://www.hl.co.uk/shares/shares-sear ... inary-2.5p

It looks as if the dividends it receives itself from invested assets are not large enough to pay the costs of administration. So with no income distributed , there's nothing for shareholders to declare.

Alaric wrote:

Meg201 wrote:I have ATT in a non ISA account does that mean I do not have to declare a dividend for this as the fund declare it gives no dividend

That's Allianz Technology IT presumably
https://www.hl.co.uk/shares/shares-sear ... inary-2.5p

It looks as if the dividends it receives itself from invested assets are not large enough to pay the costs of administration. So with no income distributed , there's nothing for shareholders to declare.

Yes, ATT is included in the list that Lootman kindly sent, a bit further up the thread:

Some growthy ITs that pay no dividends, i.e. have a zero percent yield:

Herald
Smithson
North Atlantic Small Companies
BG US Growth
Edinburgh worldwide
Allianz Tech
BG Shin Nippon
JPM India
Biotech Growth

You can find more by going to Trustnet and sorting the set of all ITs by dividend yield.

Steve

I don't hold ETFs in taxable accounts.
The foreign income and Excess Reportable Income are pains I don't want to deal with for the tax man.
ISA and SIPP only.