Line of Duty

[servodude]

Yes, it’s terrible. It’s not the first. The 100 was completely incomprehensible, and the recent The Terror not much better.

I can’t work out if this is just me getting old, or another of those terrible modern production techniques that directors think are so clever. Like quick cut editing and swirly moving cameras. Just because the technology makes it possible, does not mean it is a good idea guys. Atmospheric mumbling does not add authenticity if no one can understand what your characters are saying. But my lack of comprehension does seem to be restricted to just a few drama series.

Gryff

I find similar problems on an increasing number of programmes. I know my ears are ageing, but they are not that bad.

I suspect the problem is that sound engineers and editors are wearing headphones or in editing suites with high-quality speakers. Make them use a typical flat-screen TV with rear-facing speakers. Much more reflective of reality in a typical household

--kiloran

This is most probably the truth
- and why my Cambridge Audio A5 has been in service under several different TV over the past 20 years
- TOP_TIP: fold the monitor channel to a wireless headphone broadcast and watch in comfort while the family sleep

-sd

[terminal7]

One small quibble - do other Fools find the sound poor at times - the OH and I (pair of old dodderers) - having great difficulty in understanding several of the characters

Thanks deaf Fools for your answers. I strongly suspect that yes there is an element of ageing ears but why can I clearly hear every inane word of gurning Greg as well as news programme presenters?

T7

[Arborbridge]

Some of this is our hearing problem, but by no means all. If you watch the older style films - even American ones - the actors sound the ends of their words and can mostly be heard. It applies to singers too. Take pop singers around the 50's and you can hear the words.
A direct comparison can be heard in Westerns. You can always tell a modern Western because the speech is slurred and the words run into one another. I think some director or actor commented on this change of fashion recently, so we aren't the only ones who find it difficult. Peak Mumble was hopefully Jamaica Inn, in which all the actors were intolerable mumblers. This caused a large number of complaints, but we were told it was all are fault for having lousy sound systems on our TVs. That's complete nonsense, because even with my headphones, you couldn't hear a word. They were mumbling but wouldn't admit it.

I watched Too Close thie week, and although speaking quietly, the two actresses could generally be heard well. At the same time, I've been watching Buffy the Vampire Slayer, and Sarah Michelle Gellar is a real mumbler - I forgive her only because she is good in the part and often communicates by facial gestures, enough to get the gist. Compare with Rupert Giles in the same series, who is always clear.

Arb.

[absolutezero]

Yes, it’s terrible. It’s not the first. The 100 was completely incomprehensible, and the recent The Terror not much better.

I can’t work out if this is just me getting old, or another of those terrible modern production techniques that directors think are so clever. Like quick cut editing and swirly moving cameras. Just because the technology makes it possible, does not mean it is a good idea guys. Atmospheric mumbling does not add authenticity if no one can understand what your characters are saying. But my lack of comprehension does seem to be restricted to just a few drama series.

Gryff

I find similar problems on an increasing number of programmes. I know my ears are ageing, but they are not that bad.

I suspect the problem is that sound engineers and editors are wearing headphones or in editing suites with high-quality speakers. Make them use a typical flat-screen TV with rear-facing speakers. Much more reflective of reality in a typical household

--kiloran

It is exactly this.
When Doctor Who was resurrected in 2005 there were lots of complaints about sound quality. Music too loud. Dialogue drowned out. Etc.
The BBC put out an 'apology' saying words to the effect of "Doctor Who has a very ambitious soundtrack and some lower quality TV speakers will not do it justice."
Cue lots of moaning on the Doctor Who forum that 'my TV is not low quality'. Etc.

[Arborbridge]

When Doctor Who was resurrected in 2005 there were lots of complaints about sound quality. Music too loud. Dialogue drowned out. Etc.

And don't get me started on "background" music! One of my absolute pet hates is music drowning out the speech. Why the heck can't someone listen to the music and turn it down? The object is to hear what is said, not have concert of the music.

It is nothing to do with sound bars, TV speakers etc. I use headphones and the balance is just as hopeless.

Which reminds me of another ancient problem: on radio, why do they broadcast audience laughter louder louder than the speech? It's unpleasant, and often the subsequent conversation or retort will be entirely drowned out. After nearly a hundred years experience, you would think they could get it right.

Arb.

[terminal7]

There is a wonderful adaptation of Romeo and Juliet on TV that had been scheduled for the NFT for summer 2020. Very original production with high class acting. It was shown on Sky Arts about a week ago and they are repeating it at regular intervals.

BUT - the very original background music at times is very foreground and drowns out the sotto voce stuff at times.

T7

[XFool]

One small quibble - do other Fools find the sound poor at times - the OH and I (pair of old dodderers) - having great difficulty in understanding several of the characters?

Yes, it’s terrible. It’s not the first. The 100 was completely incomprehensible, and the recent The Terror not much better.

I can’t work out if this is just me getting old, or another of those terrible modern production techniques that directors think are so clever. Like quick cut editing and swirly moving cameras.

If by "swirly moving cameras" you mean those silly jigging, twitchy camera movements (you may not) then Thank the Lord they have generally fallen out of favour since their idiotic heyday in the late 1990s, 2000s. I recently had the awful experience of suddenly revisiting them in an episode of a repeat of The Bill on Drama (~2009, 2010?). New cameraman? New director, producer? Must have been a temporary stand in, or somebody eventually put bromide in their coffee, as it calmed down over time.

Just because the technology makes it possible, does not mean it is a good idea guys. Atmospheric mumbling does not add authenticity if no one can understand what your characters are saying. But my lack of comprehension does seem to be restricted to just a few drama series.

What was that series a few years ago on BBC1, based on the UK having been successfully invaded by the Nazis? Caused loads of complaints and discussion, even led to the BBC adjusting the soundtrack. People complained they could understand the Germans better that the English - because the Germans were speaking German and so had subtitles.

IMO, this problem has a combination of causes: The way acting technique has developed over time; the way TV series are now in effect big budget cinema type productions; big cinema style TV screens - with lousy, little, badly mounted speakers; plus an ageing audience...

[Arborbridge]

There is a wonderful adaptation of Romeo and Juliet on TV that had been scheduled for the NFT for summer 2020. Very original production with high class acting. It was shown on Sky Arts about a week ago and they are repeating it at regular intervals.

BUT - the very original background music at times is very foreground and drowns out the sotto voce stuff at times.

T7

If you ever get the chance, watch the Royal Ballet film of Romeo and Juliet. Not the film of the stage version, but the film they made with Francesca Heyward as Juliet shot on location. I don't believe there has been a better version of the ballet. And there the music is essential and beautiful!
Who would imagine you could do the play without the words?

Arb.

[terminal7]

Three in car park - 2 shots - who has been shot? Kate and/or Jo and/or Pilkington????

T7

7 days to wait!

[Watis]

Three in car park - 2 shots - who has been shot? Kate and/or Jo and/or Pilkington????

T7

7 days to wait!

Indeed. Or, is one (or both) shots from someone else who has arrived, unknown to us - Steve Arnott, perhaps?

Watis

[terminal7]

Surely Steve could not get there that quickly unless AC-12 is based around the corner from the 'surely no-one in their right mind would visit on a dark rainy night ' unlit courtyard.

T7

[Gerry557]

You mean it wasn't a car backfiring ............. Twice!

[terminal7]

TLF Health Warning

Before anyone gets too perplexed at the end of episode 6 today - this series has 7 episodes.

Dr T7

[JohnB]

https://lineofduty.fandom.com/wiki/Line_of_Duty has 587 pages on the show, but this time I've watched a show without a fan wiki open next to the video. Unlike Game of Thrones, when I could never remember why 2 characters had a grudge.

[XFool]

You mean it wasn't a car backfiring ............. Twice!

"As AC-12 struggles to deal with the repercussions of tragic events..."

OK, I'll risk it: DI Kate Fleming was killed. OR Kate Fleming was shot but not killed and PC Ryan Pilkington was killed.

Or something else.

[terminal7]

Or something else.

or Pilkington's achilles tendon snapped and he fired his gun into the sky and nobody was killed.

T7

[XFool]

Crikey! So many names.. I'm too old for this now, I'm lost.

Now for Between the Lines on BBC4.

[Laughton]

I think we should have been given a warning before Episode 1 of Series 1:

"Wait until after the end of the last series and then binge watch all series on iPlayer as that's the only possible way you will be able to follow the plot and remember all the characters"

[richfool]

The Big Boss with the Nth Irish accent is hiding something, unless of course it's just a red herring, but yes, I'm lost too, though I have only seen some episodes and didn't see the last one..

[Mike88]

I haven't a clue what is going on but really enjoyed last night's episode.