Visit to Dundee

[simsqu]

Well, we went to Dundee as mentioned weekend before last, primarily to see the V&A before going on to the Edinburgh Festival. The V&A itself was worth visiting: interesting architecture, both inside & out. Fantastic view from the café and a really well curated exhibition about Michael Clark, a contemporary dancer about who I knew nothing.

BUT, let’s face it, apart from the V&A, Dundee is a dump.

It lost out to Hull for the title of UK City of Culture 2017, which tells you everything you need to know. Clearly by siting the V&A there, someone is trying to make a statement about, I don’t know, regeneration or something, but the trouble is, you see this so often. Liverpool is another example. A politician’s soundbite about levelling up is grabbed onto, and suddenly a spotlight is thrown on some godforsaken ghastly post-industrial Northern has-been of a city, a vanity project is built, a bid for City of Culture is made, or some other meaningless made up twaddle to sound good on the tourist website, but then the spotlight moves on, leaving the city in exactly the same state as it was before, except that there’s a shiny new photo opportunity sitting in the middle of the now-flattened old docks / industrial centre / bunch of warehouses, which fill up with coffee shops, Nandos, Cote Brasseries, and Prezzos, occupying the bleak windswept dockside.

So we won’t be returning anytime soon. At least we didn’t hear too many bagpipes, and Edinburgh Festival was GREAT

[Dod101]

I come from Dundee. It is a good place to come from. I said it a couple of weeks ago mainly I think to Snorvey. The waterfront, that is the V & A and the Discovery, are both worth seeing but that is about it and I certainly would not go out of my way to see either unless you are passing through. The Tay estuary sports a few nice little villages down the Coast to Arbroath.

I lived there until I was 21 and have never lived there again.

Dod

[Dod101]

I come from Dundee. It is a good place to come from. I said it a couple of weeks ago mainly I think to Snorvey. The waterfront, that is the V & A and the Discovery, are both worth seeing but that is about it and I certainly would not go out of my way to see either unless you are passing through. The Tay estuary sports a few nice little villages down the Coast to Arbroath.

I lived there until I was 21 and have never lived there again.

Dod

What I should have said of course, is that to a visitor it is always going to have limited appeal. It has a wonderful location but it is a small post industrial town which has never really found its niche although it has a big teaching hospital and quite a bit of medical research, plus quite a lot of computer games originate there.

Dod

[Lootman]

Well, we went to Dundee as mentioned weekend before last, primarily to see the V&A before going on to the Edinburgh Festival. The V&A itself was worth visiting: interesting architecture, both inside & out. Fantastic view from the café and a really well curated exhibition about Michael Clark, a contemporary dancer about who I knew nothing.

BUT, let’s face it, apart from the V&A, Dundee is a dump.

It lost out to Hull for the title of UK City of Culture 2017, which tells you everything you need to know. Clearly by siting the V&A there, someone is trying to make a statement about, I don’t know, regeneration or something, but the trouble is, you see this so often. Liverpool is another example. A politician’s soundbite about levelling up is grabbed onto, and suddenly a spotlight is thrown on some godforsaken ghastly post-industrial Northern has-been of a city, a vanity project is built, a bid for City of Culture is made, or some other meaningless made up twaddle to sound good on the tourist website, but then the spotlight moves on, leaving the city in exactly the same state as it was before, except that there’s a shiny new photo opportunity sitting in the middle of the now-flattened old docks / industrial centre / bunch of warehouses, which fill up with coffee shops, Nandos, Cote Brasseries, and Prezzos, occupying the bleak windswept dockside.

So we won’t be returning anytime soon. At least we didn’t hear too many bagpipes, and Edinburgh Festival was GREAT

Liverpool was a European City of Culture (European Capital of Cultural (ECoC)) in 2008, which is a much bigger deal than merely being the annual UK City of Culture.

There were some worthy additions to Liverpool made as a result, and it is now a significant tourist destination. Some other outcomes from it were rubbish, however, especially on the waterfront which is what the city is all about.

[Mike88]

All I know about Dundee is cake.

[bluedonkey]

Although we stayed in Dundee, we were at various places - Monifieth is pleasant enough and we also went across the river into FIfe farming country which is very pretty indeed. Dundee, in common with many large UK cities, acts as a bit of a dumping ground for the surrounding area. North, South East and West of Dundee are perfectly pleasant. It's just Dundee. And that's why its a nationalist hotbed.

...but Dundee used to be a great city. I don't think a nice museum is it's silver bullet to prosperity though.

I was going to mention St Andrews as a contrast which is not far away from Dundee but you've summed it up.

[Dod101]

All I know about Dundee is cake.

It used to be jute, jam and journalism. Journalism survives through D C Thomson, publisher of the local daily newspaper andbthe various comics and so on. The other two have long since closed up.

Dod

[bluedonkey]

All I know about Dundee is cake.

It used to be jute, jam and journalism. Journalism survives through D C Thomson, publisher of the local daily newspaper andbthe various comics and so on. The other two have long since closed up.

Dod

It's extraordinary how that JJJ saying has travelled. It was many years ago that I first heard that saying and yet had never been to Scotland and no Scottish connections!

[Clariman]

I think calling Dundee a "dump" and the V&A a "vanity project" is grossly unfair and inaccurate. Like many cities that has lost much industry it is not without issues, but it has much going for it and is under a programme of significant improvement.

Over the last 10 years much has been done to reconnect the city with the Riverside. It had been cut off in the1960s with a high rise city council building and roads. These were demolished which has paved the way for the V&A and the Slessor Gardens, the latter also acting as an events space. In 2025 a permanent Eden Project is coming to the Dundee waterfront area, where some of the old docks were.

While there did you visit the excellent McManus Museum (art as well as museum), the small but delightful botanic garden, the excellent transport museum, or take a trip up The Law to see the stunning views of the Tay and its bridges? Or Camperdown Park with it excellent small zoo or Verdant Works (working textile museum)? Of course the Discovery Centre is an excellent museum housing Scott of the Antarctic's SS Discovery.

There is plenty to see and enjoy in Dundee for the open minded, but it is a city under development. There is also much to see in the surrounding Angus countryside and just across the water in Fife.

Clariman (no I'm not from Dundee but I've always had a soft spot for it)

[Dod101]

I think calling Dundee a "dump" and the V&A a "vanity project" is grossly unfair and inaccurate. Like many cities that has lost much industry it is not without issues, but it has much going for it and is under a programme of significant improvement.

Over the last 10 years much has been done to reconnect the city with the Riverside. It had been cut off in the1960s with a high rise city council building and roads. These were demolished which has paved the way for the V&A and the Slessor Gardens, the latter also acting as an events space. In 2025 a permanent Eden Project is coming to the Dundee waterfront area, where some of the old docks were.

While there did you visit the excellent McManus Museum (art as well as museum), the small but delightful botanic garden, the excellent transport museum, or take a trip up The Law to see the stunning views of the Tay and its bridges? Or Camperdown Park with it excellent small zoo or Verdant Works (working textile museum)? Of course the Discovery Centre is an excellent museum housing Scott of the Antarctic's SS Discovery.

There is plenty to see and enjoy in Dundee for the open minded, but it is a city under development. There is also much to see in the surrounding Angus countryside and just across the water in Fife.

Clariman (no I'm not from Dundee but I've always had a soft spot for it)

That is all true and at heart I thought it was bit insulting of the OP. However it is not a very attractive place even although it has a great location. Sadly it has been 'under development' since the end of the Second World War through various (sometimes corrupt) Labour local authorities and now the SNP.

Anyway it needs as much support as it can get so thanks for your support.

Dod

[servodude]

I think calling Dundee a "dump" and the V&A a "vanity project" is grossly unfair and inaccurate. Like many cities that has lost much industry it is not without issues, but it has much going for it and is under a programme of significant improvement.

Over the last 10 years much has been done to reconnect the city with the Riverside. It had been cut off in the1960s with a high rise city council building and roads. These were demolished which has paved the way for the V&A and the Slessor Gardens, the latter also acting as an events space. In 2025 a permanent Eden Project is coming to the Dundee waterfront area, where some of the old docks were.

While there did you visit the excellent McManus Museum (art as well as museum), the small but delightful botanic garden, the excellent transport museum, or take a trip up The Law to see the stunning views of the Tay and its bridges? Or Camperdown Park with it excellent small zoo or Verdant Works (working textile museum)? Of course the Discovery Centre is an excellent museum housing Scott of the Antarctic's SS Discovery.

There is plenty to see and enjoy in Dundee for the open minded, but it is a city under development. There is also much to see in the surrounding Angus countryside and just across the water in Fife.

Clariman (no I'm not from Dundee but I've always had a soft spot for it)

That is all true and at heart I thought it was bit insulting of the OP. However it is not a very attractive place even although it has a great location. Sadly it has been 'under development' since the end of the Second World War through various (sometimes corrupt) Labour local authorities and now the SNP.

Anyway it needs as much support as it can get so thanks for your support.

Dod

I like Dundee.

It says a lot about any Scottish city that can have its stadiums a stone's throw away from each other and not suffer from eternal stone throwing.

[pje16]

As I posted here, my experience on my one visit to Dundee was very positive
https://www.lemonfool.co.uk/viewtopic.p ... 7&p=519555

[Clariman]

Dundee even has a space program.

'Set phasers tae malky'

https://youtu.be/xar7Q2PpyIA

....and I fully accept that 99.7% of Lemonfools will look at this and wonder what the hell is going on.

[servodude]

Dundee even has a space program.

'Set phasers tae malky'

https://youtu.be/xar7Q2PpyIA

....and I fully accept that 99.7% of Lemonfools will look at this and wonder what the hell is going on.

Now I really need a Clansman programme for ma hollo'deck!

[simsqu]

I thought it was bit insulting of the OP.

Dod

Not meant to be. It just struck me as a bit of a dump. We went out the first evening (Friday, so was expecting a bit of life) and it was like a windswept abandonned wasteland, and that was the centre of town! We did eventually find a place with some sign of life called the giddy grill and it was packed. Had a great meal there.

There were two other places with some life: one was Wetherspoons - fair enough - and the other, which we did not venture into - was a karaoke bar, the sounds coming out of which were very loud and indescribably bleak.

We did get to the MacManus Museum which was fine.

We had a miserable meal the second night, and the best Turkish meal i have ever had on the Sunday, at a little restaurant called The Agacan.
On Sunday went to the Centre for Contemporary Arts and saw an Iranian film called Hit the Road, which was pretty good actually.

So it wasn't too bad, and we only had the weekend there, so hard to form a detailed opinion. Clearly stuff to do and see, but then again almost anywhere you go there is stuff to do and see. It was just not particularly impressive

[servodude]

We did get to the MacManus Museum which was fine

Some kind of permanent Taggart exhibition?

[Dod101]

I thought it was bit insulting of the OP.

Dod

Not meant to be. It just struck me as a bit of a dump. We went out the first evening (Friday, so was expecting a bit of life) and it was like a windswept abandonned wasteland, and that was the centre of town! We did eventually find a place with some sign of life called the giddy grill and it was packed. Had a great meal there.

There were two other places with some life: one was Wetherspoons - fair enough - and the other, which we did not venture into - was a karaoke bar, the sounds coming out of which were very loud and indescribably bleak.

We did get to the MacManus Museum which was fine.

We had a miserable meal the second night, and the best Turkish meal i have ever had on the Sunday, at a little restaurant called The Agacan.
On Sunday went to the Centre for Contemporary Arts and saw an Iranian film called Hit the Road, which was pretty good actually.

So it wasn't too bad, and we only had the weekend there, so hard to form a detailed opinion. Clearly stuff to do and see, but then again almost anywhere you go there is stuff to do and see. It was just not particularly impressive

Thanks. I think we have both given the wrong impressions. Nowadays I hardly go there so you have given me a few pointers. Sadly my first wife died in Ninewells Hospital there and prior to that she was on kidney dialysis in the same hospital three times each week. I took her there and as we lived a long way away I had three hours or so to myself and got to know Dundee and its environs pretty well, but that is now over 20 years ago.

It is a bit of a dump I think. It has never found its way after the jute mills closed during '50s and '60s. They have finally got round to trying to sort out the waterfront but even there it is rather 'bitty' and lacking co-ordination. Might go and take another look some time before too long.

Dod

[Charlottesquare]

Barnhill/Broughty Ferry is pleasant enough, though not vey exciting. (my mum was from Barnhill but left to go to university in Edinburgh in circa 1946 and never returned to live there ; my grandfather continued living in Barnhill until his death in the 1950s)

Seems to me it gets a bad press, the Athens of the North has some dumps but of course everyone things Old Town/New Town and forgets the outlying parts.

[bluedonkey]

What was that sitcom set in Dundee with Brian Cox? The main character kept saying people were jealous of his house extension.

[pje16]

Bob Servant