The Queen is Dead

[nimnarb]

I missed being in London by two weeks for this very remarkable occasion, and just a shame my timing wasn't better, as I definitely would have paid my respects. However, I find it quite extraordinary that I had never previously been to Horse Guards Parade or in the Park opposite and sat watching the fountain by the lake, or down Whitehall and indeed Pall Mall, Bucks Palace etc plus along the Thames and passing Big Ben etc. Passed in a car at some stage over the years, but not walked the areas and seen it properly.

I even took a fantastic video under the arches, where we saw so many times the ceremony passing,(and obviously not realizing or knowing what was to come or where), of the horses and guards passing by, so it was with great pride that I somehow felt that I was actually there. Yes, nobody does it better. That drum, that was a major force in keeping everyone together, they say, beat over 4000 times!

Truly, truly, staggering.

[Rhyd6]

I was born in the Georgian era, lived most of my life as an Elizabethan but I'm not too sure what it will be now, a Carolean or the Windsor era. The other two Charles were both Stuarts so that solved that problem.
I have been watching avidly all day across at my daighters and looking after my great grandchildren aged 6 and 8, they've been fascinated by all the ceremony etc. and joined in the singing of the hymns etc. They thought it was all wonderful even though they are so young.
I echo the thoughts of those who say that when it comes to pomp and circumsyances we really knock spots of any other country.
We had a phone call this afternoon from my cousin and his wife in America, she's an American and was moved to tears by the service and also by the sight of all the thousands of people paying their respects. She said that the monarchy was the one thing about the UK that she envied above all else.

R6

[88V8]

Well, that was a very moving day and we watched most of it.

When King Charles put the camp flag on the coffin, I blubbed a little.

V8

[Dod101]

The service itself was very conservative and traditional, not that I have anything against that, except for that awful Baroness Scotland. Who did she think she was?

What do you mean? She was the person chosen to deliver the first lesson, presumably because she is Secretary-General of the Commonwealth and presumably because that office was chosen to deliver the first lesson when the service was planned many years ago, not because she is Baroness Scotland. And the choice of the lesson would have been prescribed from many years ago too.

I take it you didn't like her delivery? I didn't watch it live but have now looked it up and watched it, and well, ok, it's a bit bland, but I'm not sure I get why it solicits "Who did she think she was?".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFmYOJkTO-k

The full order of the service is at https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/ ... -abbey.pdf

It was her delivery that got me. No doubt because of her position she read that lesson. Perfectly appropriate of course. It wasn't that some might have found it bland. I would not have minded that in the least. She was so affected and deliberate in her delivery. Awful. OTOH, our PM Lizz Truss was a model of how to do it.

Dod

[Dod101]

If it has not been said already, I found the committal service at Windsor more moving than anything else The service at the Abbey was great, safe, and everyone could relate to it, in fact had it not been in the Abbey with the huge number of dignitaries it could almost have been anyone's funeral, but the short service at Windsor was something else. When they removed the Instruments of State and the Lord Chamberlain broke his wand and placed it on the coffin, that was quite something, and then the coffin was lowered in to the vaults below.........wow.

Dod

[XFool]

I take it you didn't like her delivery? I didn't watch it live but have now looked it up and watched it, and well, ok, it's a bit bland, but I'm not sure I get why it solicits "Who did she think she was?".

It was her delivery that got me... She was so affected and deliberate in her delivery. Awful. OTOH, our PM Lizz Truss was a model of how to do it.

No. Not really. In my opinion, by far the best speaker was Bishop Welby, Archbishop of Canterbury.

[nimnarb]

For me, the stars of the show,(wrong word, really) were the 8 Pall Bearers. Think they used the same blokes each time and what with the responsibility that they carried on their shoulders,(what a great pun), they were just simply superb.

[scotview]

When they removed the Instruments of State.

Dod

Aye Dod, when the Crown was removed from the coffin, that for me was the most powerful moment. That was history before your eyes.

[Dod101]

It was her delivery that got me... She was so affected and deliberate in her delivery. Awful. OTOH, our PM Lizz Truss was a model of how to do it.

No. Not really. In my opinion, by far the best speaker was Bishop Welby, Archbishop of Canterbury.

Yes, well he has had a lot of practice. I was meaning someone reading a lesson who is not really used to doing that sort of thing. I do so from time to time in my church, so I have some idea about it.

Dod

[Dod101]

For me, the stars of the show,(wrong word, really) were the 8 Pall Bearers. Think they used the same blokes each time and what with the responsibility that they carried on their shoulders,(what a great pun), they were just simply superb.

I agree entirely and they looked pretty young as well. Drinks all round to them this evening I hope.

Dod

[terminal7]

What do you mean? She was the person chosen to deliver the first lesson, presumably because she is Secretary-General of the Commonwealth and presumably because that office was chosen to deliver the first lesson when the service was planned many years ago, not because she is Baroness Scotland. And the choice of the lesson would have been prescribed from many years ago too.

I take it you didn't like her delivery? I didn't watch it live but have now looked it up and watched it, and well, ok, it's a bit bland, but I'm not sure I get why it solicits "Who did she think she was?".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFmYOJkTO-k

The full order of the service is at https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/ ... -abbey.pdf

It was her delivery that got me. No doubt because of her position she read that lesson. Perfectly appropriate of course. It wasn't that some might have found it bland. I would not have minded that in the least. She was so affected and deliberate in her delivery. Awful. OTOH, our PM Lizz Truss was a model of how to do it.

Dod

Au contraire M Dod - Lady Penelope brings more intonation in delivery than Truss.

T7

[Clariman]

A really well organised and dignified day. Britain does do these things well. I wasn't particularly emotional which surprised me, because I usually am when there is great music at important life events. I think perhaps 10 days of it all and many hours of coffin processions numbed me a bit. That said, I did find the Windsor Chapel service more moving than the Westminster one.

I thought Baroness Scotland's delivery was far better than the Prime Minister's. She understood and phrased the words. The PM read it in a dignified manner but without an understanding of the words.

[nimnarb]

It was her delivery that got me. No doubt because of her position she read that lesson. Perfectly appropriate of course. It wasn't that some might have found it bland. I would not have minded that in the least. She was so affected and deliberate in her delivery. Awful. OTOH, our PM Lizz Truss was a model of how to do it.

Dod

Au contraire M Dod - Lady Penelope brings more intonation in delivery than Truss.

You talking about this Lady?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMaK_xNlD5c


T7

[Dod101]

A really well organised and dignified day. Britain does do these things well. I wasn't particularly emotional which surprised me, because I usually am when there is great music at important life events. I think perhaps 10 days of it all and many hours of coffin processions numbed me a bit. That said, I did find the Windsor Chapel service more moving than the Westminster one.

I thought Baroness Scotland's delivery was far better than the Prime Minister's. She understood and phrased the words. The PM read it in a dignified manner but without an understanding of the words.

In which case it much just be my Presbyterianism, but I thought Baroness Scotland was such a poseur. There are a lot of them about.

Dod

[Clariman]

A really well organised and dignified day. Britain does do these things well. I wasn't particularly emotional which surprised me, because I usually am when there is great music at important life events. I think perhaps 10 days of it all and many hours of coffin processions numbed me a bit. That said, I did find the Windsor Chapel service more moving than the Westminster one.

I thought Baroness Scotland's delivery was far better than the Prime Minister's. She understood and phrased the words. The PM read it in a dignified manner but without an understanding of the words.

In which case it much just be my Presbyterianism, but I thought Baroness Scotland was such a poseur. There are a lot of them about.

Dod

My resident Presbyterian also preferred Baroness Scotland's delivery, so can't just be down to that

[Dod101]

In which case it much just be my Presbyterianism, but I thought Baroness Scotland was such a poseur. There are a lot of them about.

Dod

My resident Presbyterian also preferred Baroness Scotland's delivery, so can't just be down to that

How do you know that Lizz Truss did not understand the words?
BTW, I am not a great supporter of Truss but she read the words in a businesslike fashion, unlike the Baroness.

Dod
Dod

[Clariman]

Truss was business like, but reading poignant funereal or biblical words should be anything but business like! I am no expert in the Bible (I'm not religious) but I have sung and played a pile of religious music and understanding the words, and breathing at phrase ends rather than randomly, is essential for delivering their meaning. The same is true for where you pause when reading and the inflections in your voice.

[kiloran]

For me, the stars of the show,(wrong word, really) were the 8 Pall Bearers. Think they used the same blokes each time and what with the responsibility that they carried on their shoulders,(what a great pun), they were just simply superb.

And also a shout-out for the Met Office for arranging lots of dry weather for the duration

--kiloran

[stewamax]

I never thought that I would say this, but - of all the commentators - David Dimbleby at Windsor gave the most informative and best-paced delivery. Perhaps he has been learning from recordings of his father.

And I also agree that the Windsor service, preceded by the slow dignified approach through 'traditional English' countryside, and on a slightly more human scale, was the best. The symbolic (as well as practical) removal of the State Crown, Sceptre and Orb to the altar, the equally symbolic breaking his wand of office by the Lord Chamberlain, and the formal recital by Garter of the transition of the reign of the Queen to the reign of the new King were incomparable.

I was wondering through both services and the journeys how the Orb stayed on the coffin, and worried a bit when it was removed and carried to the altar. I assumed correctly that it had a spike or attachment point below but wondered how then it would be able to sit on the altar cushion. Worry then over: there was a purpose-built hole in the cushion!

Finally, the arm-waving happy-clappy wing of C of E clergy may now have a backlash from their congregations' renewed interest in the unmatched language of the Book of Common Prayer and King James Bible.

[Hallucigenia]

Nine-year-old George and his sister, seven, will form part of a procession with the Royal Family, following the coffin as it enters the church.

They are children. All I can hope for is that they walk behind the Queens coffin for no more than 30 seconds and then they can be taken to a place out of the limelight and protected by privacy. This is not the sort of pressure any child should be asked to undertake.
They shouldn't have to do this. It was wrong to put William and Harry behind their mothers coffin. The emotional pressure will have burned deep into their memories.

AiY(D)

Totally agreed, at that age it is hard to even understand a death.
It is probably being done for show

Nonsense, I had a grandparent die when I was 9 and I knew what it was about. Was my understanding of death as nuanced as when another one died in my 20s? Probably not, but I still felt it.

But yes, it does make a difference that he will be king, we've had this unique few years where we've had (under current plans) four generations of monarchs alive at the same time and today's footage will be dug out and shown on holo-TV for his silver jubilee in 2100 or whenever. And in a time of change, it's not the worse thing to be emphasising the continuity implicit in the succession.

Four Canadian Mounties on horseback at the front of the late Queens funeral procession.

They are paying a great honour not just to Queen Elizabeth but the Commonwealth.

To the queen of Canada, ahead of the Commonwealth. I must admit, all those Union flags on the Mall rather jarred for me, they could have perhaps alternated them with the flags of the other countries that she was head of state of. One can't do that and then get upset when those other countries want to become republics, it just seems bad politics.

Also - they could have at least had the horses behind the coffin, or fitted them with nappies, I couldn't help thinking of all those shiny boots having to walk through what the horses left behind...