A massive change in public opinion or …?

[Clitheroekid]

Someone sent me a link to a feature written by Vladimir Zelinsky praising Boris Johnson in the Daily Mail – https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... -hope.html

As usual, I had a look at the comments, expecting them to be full of praise for both Zelensky and Johnson. I was therefore quite shocked to see that the best rated replies were quite the opposite – highly critical of both Zelensky and the UK’s support for Ukraine.

From speaking to people generally I’m not remotely aware of any such national change of heart, but can the Russian bots really be employed so rapidly and effectively?

[AF62]

but can the Russian bots really be employed so rapidly and effectively?

Perhaps, but the answer is probably more straightforward.

The Daily Mail’s online readership is made up of an awful lot of Americans and Biden’s support of Ukraine likely provokes a negative response from some of those who voted for Trump.

[SalvorHardin]

Someone sent me a link to a feature written by Vladimir Zelinsky praising Boris Johnson in the Daily Mail – https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... -hope.html

As usual, I had a look at the comments, expecting them to be full of praise for both Zelensky and Johnson. I was therefore quite shocked to see that the best rated replies were quite the opposite – highly critical of both Zelensky and the UK’s support for Ukraine.

From speaking to people generally I’m not remotely aware of any such national change of heart, but can the Russian bots really be employed so rapidly and effectively?

Yes, Russia employs a lot of people to do this on many websites. They're easy to spot as they're very unsubtle.

A lot of Americans have sided with Putin solely because Biden is supporting Ukraine. The comments sections of major American websites tend to be full of them.

The site where I notice it the most is Instapundit, which is very much a Libertarian-Conservative site (very pro freedom of speech), where I'm usually very much in agreement with the majority in the comments sections. Unless it's a pro-Ukraine article, when the comments are dominated by pro-Putin anti-Zekensky Americans.

[Adamski]

I was therefore quite shocked to see that the best rated replies were quite the opposite – highly critical of both Zelensky and the UK’s support for Ukraine.

It's because Boris has sent billions with no accountability, at no cost to himself, but lapped up praise to boost his ego and make himself look good. The British public can see through the Churchill act. Its not Ukraine but boris who Mail readers have problem with.

[Howyoudoin]

I was therefore quite shocked to see that the best rated replies were quite the opposite – highly critical of both Zelensky and the UK’s support for Ukraine.

It's because Boris has sent billions with no accountability, at no cost to himself, but lapped up praise to boost his ego and make himself look good. The British public can see through the Churchill act. Its not Ukraine but boris who Mail readers have problem with.

Sigh.

I sincerely hope that whoever takes over from Boris, continues with helping Ukraine. If sending money and weapons to Ukraine and visiting Zelensky on his own patch means that Boris is trying to ‘boost his ego and make himself look good’ then I would hope that the majority of the UK is behind him in these actions. Would you make the journey and visit Kyiv at the moment? There are many World Leaders who haven’t. Too scared.

I’m more worried about getting my Wife’s family out of Crimea if things get any worse. It is also Ukrainian tradition that the new baby’s Grandmother spends the first few months with the Mother in order to help her through the early days. We have been denied that opportunity by Putin’s actions.

There is a potential route for those in Crimea to come to the UK, which involves traversing through many countries but it’s not really feasible for a 70 year old. Oddly, when we put this to the Grandmother, she was not worried at all about the long and arduous journey, she was worried that an escalation of the war would mean that she couldn’t get back home! They’re made of stern stuff these Ukrainians.

Having recently moved from a 1 bed flat in West London to a 3 bed house in East London, I’ve told my Wife that we should try and get her family here at all costs as I think the worst is yet to come.

But it’s complicated. My Wife’s Father will never leave his home whatever happens and he will never allow his wife ( my baby’s Grandmother) to leave their home unless we lie to him and say it’s temporary.

The rest of her family are sitting it out, as ‘not much’ has happened in Crimea so far other than weapons factories and temporary Russian war airports being hit. Not much!!! These huge bombings are within 5 miles of their (very) humble abode.

I could write a book about this stuff from the POV of an Englishman married to a Ukrainian. But I’ll leave it at that for now and hope that I’ve managed to convey just a little of what is going on in our minds.

HYD

[AsleepInYorkshire]

I was therefore quite shocked to see that the best rated replies were quite the opposite – highly critical of both Zelensky and the UK’s support for Ukraine.

It's because Boris has sent billions with no accountability, at no cost to himself, but lapped up praise to boost his ego and make himself look good. The British public can see through the Churchill act. Its not Ukraine but boris who Mail readers have problem with.

I consider myself a British citizen. I have a British birth certificate and passport confirming this. Regardless of who gets the praise and whether the funds come from Boris Johnson's personal account, where they have ended up, seems correct to me.

AiY(D)

[monabri]

If we can spaff £32bn on a copy of 16-bit Excel and a phone service (aka "Track and Lose") then a few billion sent to defend an independent country against a a-hole of a deluded dictator seems money well spent.

[Howyoudoin]

Someone sent me a link to a feature written by Vladimir Zelinsky praising Boris Johnson in the Daily Mail – https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... -hope.html

As usual, I had a look at the comments, expecting them to be full of praise for both Zelensky and Johnson. I was therefore quite shocked to see that the best rated replies were quite the opposite – highly critical of both Zelensky and the UK’s support for Ukraine.

From speaking to people generally I’m not remotely aware of any such national change of heart, but can the Russian bots really be employed so rapidly and effectively?

Who needs Russian bots when even on a fairly sensible website like this, there are those that are are highly critical of the UK’s support for Ukraine?

HYD

[Howyoudoin]

If we can spaff £32bn on a copy of 16-bit Excel and a phone service (aka "Track and Lose") then a few billion sent to defend an independent country against a a-hole of a deluded dictator seems money well spent.

[Deletion.]

https://fullfact.org/health/test-trace-march-2021/

The cost of developing the NHS Test and Trace app is uncertain, but estimates are in the tens of millions, rather than billions of pounds.

[Deletion.]

HYD

Moderator Message:
Shouty and unnecessarily rude bits removed. - Chris

[Lanark]

If we can spaff £32bn on a copy of 16-bit Excel and a phone service (aka "Track and Lose") then a few billion sent to defend an independent country against a a-hole of a deluded dictator seems money well spent.

[Deletion.]

https://fullfact.org/health/test-trace-march-2021/

The cost of developing the NHS Test and Trace app is uncertain, but estimates are in the tens of millions, rather than billions of pounds.

[Deletion.]

HYD

From that link:
By the end of October 2020, around £478 million was estimated to have been spent on contact tracing by NHS specialists, Serco and other contractors. The NAO also told Full Fact that this amount also included other costs for central staff, and may have included some funding for PHE in its local efforts to trace complex cases, but it was unsure how much.

So not 32 billion, but not nothing either.

[CliffEdge]

If we can spaff £32bn on a copy of 16-bit Excel and a phone service (aka "Track and Lose") then a few billion sent to defend an independent country against a a-hole of a deluded dictator seems money well spent.

[Deletion.]

https://fullfact.org/health/test-trace-march-2021/

The cost of developing the NHS Test and Trace app is uncertain, but estimates are in the tens of millions, rather than billions of pounds.

[Deletion.]

HYD

I think you've completely missed the point, again.

[Arborbridge]

Daily Mail readers commenting? Is it any surprise that they would be cynical about any effort spent on helping anything "foreign" - I think goes with the Faragist, Brexit anti immigration territory of that readership.
The fear is that this will be worked on by the Russians and turned into a false "movement" putting pressure on HMG to alter our stance.


Arb.

[Adamski]

Perhaps my post badly worded sure support for Ukraine will continue, plus defence spending increase under liz Truss. Whatever Boris does is unpopular, that was my point.

[servodude]

Daily Mail readers commenting? Is it any surprise that they would be cynical about any effort spent on helping anything "foreign" - I think goes with the Faragist, Brexit anti immigration territory of that readership.
The fear is that this will be worked on by the Russians and turned into a false "movement" putting pressure on HMG to alter our stance.


Arb.

Given how much they the Ruskies had backed BoJo I'm hoping they've realized that if they couldn't turn that fickle flighty fud they might as well turn the guns inward

[GrahamPlatt]

I listened to this earlier. A pretty good analysis. Regarding public opinion, skip straight to the 1 hour mark and listen for about ten minutes.

https://youtu.be/ce5TR-qWCk4

The particularly important point at 1hr 8mins 47secs, talking of American public opinion is “if you see a pro-Russian source arguing that the numbers are perhaps opposite that, and that the majority of Americans are actually dissatisfied, look very closely at the question”.. it seems that if you ask if they support Ukraine, and giving money and weapons to Ukraine for as long as is needed, more than half agree. If asked if they agree with Joe Borden’s package of support for Ukraine, then the numbers drop.

[absolutezero]

People are linking Ukraine with gas bills.
People support anything until it hits them in the pocket. Then they turn.